itismyturntomakeamake a public speechhheretoday是什么意思
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官方公共微信Four Corners - 15/03/2010: Program Transcript
<meta name="Description" content="Read the program transcript from Liz Jackson's report The Authentic Mr Abbott, first broadcast 19 March 2010.">
CAMERAMAN: Okay, this is Mr Abbott by the looks of it. Oh, this is ideal.
LIZ JACKSON, REPORTER: Tony Abbott is arriving at a primary school in a marginal seat in Perth.
TONY ABBOTT, LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (to school principal): Good to see you. Lo it's great to be here.
LIZ JACKSON: The Federal election has yet to called, but the Opposition's new leader is already in full on campaign mode.
He's after Kevin Rudd's job, and happy to tell anyone who'll listen.
TONY ABBOTT (to school children): I'm from Canberra and I'm what's called the Opposition Leader.
And every day I have an argument with someone called the Prime Minister about who should be leading the country and what's best for the country.
(Tony meeting people in shopping centre)
TONY ABBOTT: G'day, how are you? Tony Abbott.
VOX POP: Hi Tony.
TONY ABBOTT: Hello, how are you?
Tony Abbott, John. I'd better have a lamington I think.
Hello, I'm Tony Abbott.
I can't resist a photo opp.
VOX POP 2: You've got to do it.
LIZ JACKSON: After the primary school stop, it's the shopping mall just down the road.
The latest poll in Western Australia puts the Coalition now just in front of Labor and we're given a moment to chat.
(To Tony Abbott) Have you thought yet about winning?
TONY ABBOTT: Ah, I don't want to get ahead of myself. I mean, we have to become competitive and we're getting there, but let's wait until we're competitive for a few months before I start to...
LIZ JACKSON: Having those fantasy about power?
TONY ABBOTT: Yeah, that's right, that's right. That's absolutely right, yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: I think I'll let you off the hook at this point.
TONY ABBOTT: Alright. Okay. Thanks Liz. See you soon.
LIZ JACKSON: And we'll catch up for a full on interview later.
The big question still to be asked is how Tony Abbott as the new leader of his party and potentially the nation, will choose to use his power?
MALCOLM TURNBULL, LIBERAL LEADER : You will see, the Liberal Party will have a more conservative, more right wing, if you like, position on many issues with Tony as leader than it would with me.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT, VICE-RECTOR ST PATRICK'S : His own views? Yeah, of course they shape his politics.
What would he like to see in an ideal world? Catholic morality.
JOHN HOWARD, PRIME MINISTER : Tony's an authentic person and I think a lot of people see Tony as somebody who actually believes in something.
JOHN HEWSON, LIBERAL PARTY LEADER : Authentic to what though? To himself? To opportunity?
TONY ABBOTT: How are you Liz?
LIZ JACKSON: Tonight on Four Corners, we're seeking to uncover the authentic Mr Abbott.
(On screen text: The Authentic Mr Abbott)
It's two months since Tony Abbott took over the leader's office. He was, on the day, the only leadership contender calling on Liberal party to ditch its support for an emissions trading scheme.
(Tony Abbot walks down corridor)
TONY ABBOTT (to cameraman): It's a real skill this walking backwards business, isn't it?
LIZ JACKSON: In the final ballot he defeated Malcolm Turnbull by just one vote.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: I think it was entirely political in Tony's case. The real issue for me is the policy. You know, the... why are we in public life? Why am I a Member of Parliament?
I'm a Member of Parliament to make Australia a safer and a better place for Australians today and for Australians in generations to come. And we cannot do that without having an effective policy on climate change.
LIZ JACKSON: Inside the party room Abbott's early success in the polls is regarded as proof positive that Abbott read the politics right.
It's good too for old friends and John Howard's stalwarts, now back on the front bench.
There's also a mood change here - a buzz - that maybe now the Liberals have a leader who just might win.
TONY ABBOTT: Okay, colleagues this is our second party room meeting of the year. We meet under even better circumstances than we did last week. Yes, we can win.
PARTY ROOM (in unison): Hear, hear.
TONY ABBOTT: And I want to say to all of you, go out there, sell the message, respect your colleagues, but train your fire on the other side and we can win this election.
PARTY ROOM (in unison): Hear, hear.
(Applause from party room)
CHRISTOPHER PYNE, SHADOW MINISTER FOR EDUCATION: Our thinking has moved from holding onto the furniture at the next election, to build after that, ah to we cou It's possible that we could win the election.
JOHN HOWARD: We are in now with a chance, but you can't put it any more strongly than that at present.
LIZ JACKSON: And that's down to Tony Abbott?
JOHN HOWARD: Yes. Tony has altered there's no doubt about that. There's no disrespect to anybody else, but if you don't recognise that, well, you don't recognise anything about Australian politics.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott grew up in a comfortably well off conservative Catholic family on Sydney's north shore.
(On screen: Photo of Tony as a boy).
This is him at his first communion. He was the eldest of four children and long time friends say his family thought he was the star.
FATHER EMMETT COSTELLO, CHAPLIN, ST IGNATIUS' COLLEGE : His mother and father had boundle boundless ambition. And they naturally promoted all his ambitions extensively and he was... I think he had three sisters. Well, Tony was the most intelligent in the family by far.
GREG SHERIDAN, FRIEND: I think they all thought Tony was a bit of a star, but at the same time they had a very good teasing relationship with him.
LIZ JACKSON: In 1970 Tony Abbott was sent to St Ignatius' College, Riverview.
(On screen: photo of school class)
This is his first form class photo. The College was founded by the Jesuits back in 1880 on Sydney's Lane Cove River. It's one of the most prestigious and expensive Catholic Schools in the country.
ANTHONY CURTAIN, SCHOOL FRIEND: You've been to the grounds. I mean, it's a magnificent spot. You know, there are opportunities that you have there that you may not have at other schools.
So, you know, it was... basically it was a privilege to be able to go there.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott came top of his year in form one, form two, form three and form four. In his final year he won His Eminence the Cardinal's prize for Religious Knowledge. Father Emmett Costello says the young Tony Abbott's faith was deep.
FATHER EMMETT COSTELLO: Very deep, unlike other boys at that age. Always very deep, and that's rather... surprised me.
ANTHONY CURTAIN: I think society generally was much more religious, and certainly I think, you know, our parents... it was a prime reason for sending us to the school.
LIZ JACKSON: In 1976 Tony Abbott enrolled to study economics law at Sydney University.
He threw himself into student politics as a warrior for the right. Within a year he was on the Students Representative Council. Within three, he was the SRC president.
The Australian's Greg Sheridan was one of his close friends.
GREG SHERIDAN: That was a very left dominated undergraduate life. You know, most students didn't vote
it was only a small minority of people who bothered to vote, and those who voted were generally on the left.
And it was unusual, indeed it was almost ah unheard of, for someone who was taking a strong anti-left position to win a popular election like that. So they... they really detested him.
LIZ JACKSON (to Margaret Kirby): What in your view was he trying to achieve?
MARGARET KIRBY, SRC WOMEN'S COLLECTIVE : He wanted to smash the left and feminist forces.
LIZ JACKSON: One of Tony Abbott's main targets was the SRC itself. He led an unsuccessful campaign against its compulsory student fees.
TONY ABBOTT (to reporter 1979): I do not think that the SRC has been looking after student interests. Its polici they've been radical and they've been divisive. In fact, I think it can be said that all the SRC has done is give students a bad name in recent years.
LIZ JACKSON: He wrote colourful accounts of the SRC
this about the Women's Collective.
(On screen text: Grim faced, overall clad, hard, strident, often lustfully embracing in a counterfeit of love).
And this was Abbott on feminism.
(On screen text: I think it would be folly to expect that women will ever dominate or even approach equal representation in a large number of areas simply because their aptitudes, abilities and interests are different for physiological reasons).
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): What do you think about those views now?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I just don't want to go over old ground too much Liz.
Ah, I don't want to repudiate what was said, but I don't want people to think that what I thought as a 21 year old is necessarily what I think as a 52 year old.
LIZ JACKSON (to Malcolm Turnbull): Do you remember Tony Abbott from student days?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Ah, not... not terribly well. He was a few years behind me, so I had you know
not a lot.
LIZ JACKSON: But you wrote about him when you were working at The Bulletin?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Yes, that's right. I had something to say about him in an article in The Bulletin. I'd written about student...student politics, yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you remember what you said?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Not really, no. You remind me.
LIZ JACKSON: The Bulletin, 1978. The journalist, Malcolm Turnbull.
(One screen text: The leading light of the right wingers in New South Wales is twenty-year-old Tony Abbott. He has written a number of articles... (which have) given him a stature his rather boisterous and immature rhetoric doesn't really deserve. Abbott is opposed to any legalisation of homosexuality and generally presents an old fashioned DLP image)
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): When did you change your mind on that?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I guess as time has gone by I've had a much wider experience of life, certainly when it comes to homosexuality.
I have many friends who are gay. I've never had a personal issue with it. I've always treated people as I find them and that's the way it should be.
LIZ JACKSON: At the end of 1980 Tony Abbott won a Rhodes scholarship to Oxford University.
He came away with an MA in politics and philosophy, and two Oxford blues for boxing.
The local paper headlined his debut fight 'Action Man Abbo blasts his way to victory', and reported him as saying of one of his later wins 'I just made believe my opponent was Bob Hawke, the leader of the Labor Party'.
Within a year of returning from Oxford, Tony Abbott had decided to train for the priesthood. It was a decision he discussed with Jesuit priest and friend, Father Michael Kelly.
LIZ JACKSON (to Father Michael Kelly): Can you illuminate that decision for us?
FATHER MICHAEL KELLY, FRIEND: Tony's of a generation and I'm of that generation too that really prized, actually, the ideals and the sacrifice entailed in... in priestly service.
I mean there's no money in it, there's no sex in it and there's no rea in fact now you're something of a... perceived as being some of a social neuter or an inadequate person in some way if you're a priest.
But 30 years ago... 30 years ago there was a culture that saw that sort of idealism and self-sacrifice as a noble thing.
LIZ JACKSON: Why do you think he chose to go to St Patricks rather than with the Jesuits?
FATHER MICHAEL KELLY: He wanted to be Archbishop of Sydney.
LIZ JACKSON: St Patrick's College opened in 1889. It was the oldest and largest seminary in the country. The trainee priests and their superiors had heard about Abbott before he arrived.
NOEL DEBIEN, CLASSMATE, ST PATRICK'S COLLEGE: He was known for his boxing, for his success at Oxford. He was a big fish who was coming into what was effectively a small pond.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT: The former rector, the fellow who was in charge of the place before I got there, had remarked to me of Tony that, you know, we needed to look af that if he... outside of this place, he could be Prime Minister you know.
Now, I was never quite as impressed as that, but I mean, a very capable guy.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott spent three years struggling to be a priest, then quit and went public. He wrote in the Bulletin that his dream had died. He missed, he said, 'the glittering company of Oxford, the student hurly-burly'.
The seminary 'lacked imagination and virility' and the 'lack of sensual intimacy had' in his case 'become a heavy burden'. He had reached the point of 'loathing' the place.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT: 'I loathed it'. There can be a flamboyance to... an extravagance to Tony's way of putting things - the one the one liner - and sometimes going to the extreme version for impact, he'll do that.
NOEL DEBIEN: Some people thought a semina that a seminaria that a seminarian should not make waves. That wasn't Tony.
TONY ABBOTT: It was difficult time of my life because I was wrestling with what I thought was a calling, but I was also wrestling with my nature, which didn't take easily to the life of the seminary. And I guess that was why I found it... I found it difficult and ultimately why I left.
It was while Tony Abbott was working as a journalist for the Bulletin, that he first met John Howard. They got on well.
JOHN HOWARD: Very intelligent, easy to talk to, had a lot of
was traditional about a lot of things, but he was also somebody with a great enquiring mind.
LIZ JACKSON: When you say a lot of ideas similar to your own, what sort of things are you talking about?
JOHN HOWARD: Well, he saw Australia as something of an outpost of Western civilisation and values in the Asian Pacific region, and having to combine the history and the geography of our country, which he thought we could do...
LIZ JACKSON: Did you spot him as a potential political talent early on?
JOHN HOWARD: Oh yes, I thought he had real political talent, and he'd been... he'd been active in in university politics. Ah, and I'd heard about his activism in university politics and he was obviously active on the anti-Labor side.
(Archive footage from rugby match)
COMMENTATOR: He's done it again. Four straight penalty goals...
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: In 1990 John Howard ran into Tony Abbott at the Sydney Football stadium. Abbott wanted to move into politics, and John Howard was happy to help.
JOHN HEWSON (3 April 1990): Today is a new start.
LIZ JACKSON: There was job going as press secretary to Dr John Hewson, who'd just become the Liberal leader.
JOHN HOWARD: And I said to Tony, 'you want to go and work for Hewie?' And he did.
JOHN HEWSON: He was one of the most interesting and challenging people on the one hand, and one of the most frustrating people I've ever met in my life, and I think that summarises him.
LIZ JACKSON: And why do you say frustrating?
JOHN HEWSON: Ton always has had his own agenda, and it was often difficult to know what it was.
I mean, sometimes you just thought it was to be outlandish and other times it was to, you know, he was... he had a pretty strong view about a particular issue.
He was always pretty much on the right, and issues that were very important to him, like the monarchy, he would allow to dominate his thinking on other issues as well.
(Archive news footage of Dr Hewson entering Parliament)
REPORTER: Good morning Dr Hewson, the ANZ job figures...
LIZ JACKSON: Despite their differences Dr Hewson acknowledges his former press secretary knows how to use the media.
JOHN HEWSON: What you've got is constant colour and movement, and he's very good at it. His strengths are, he's... he's obviously very bright, but he's very cunning, and I think that cunningness shows.
And he can see and issue and he can grab an issue. And how does he handle it? He gets right in your face. H he grabs the headlines, even if he knows that the next day he's gonna have to back that off.
Good example is the accusation this week... last week of, you know, a bribe to Channel 7 with the... with the reduction in the TV license fees.
The word bribe appears, it gets the headline, it creates all the atmosphere. Next day he doesn't
he just says it doesn't look good, let's go on. And he's played that role out.
JOHN HEWSON (13 March 1993): Finally, I want to thank th they shared our dream.
LIZ JACKSON: After Dr Hewson lost the unlosable election, Hewson and Abbott parted ways. Tony Abbott took a job as the Executive Director of Australians for Constitutional Monarchy.
JOHN HEWSON: Well, I was pleased he did because I encouraged him to do it. I think I had a big role in T I did.
LIZ JACKSON: And what did you say to encourage him to do that?
JOHN HOWARD: Well, I told him a couple of things. I said 'mate, you're a believer in this cause. There aren't too many people who've got the guts at the moment to put their hands up for it' because it was pretty unfashionable with the media.
And at that time the polls seemed to be going heavily against the status quo. And I said 'on top of that Tony, it will bring you into contact with a lot of people who are active Liberals and that won't do your future aspirations any harm'.
(Archive footage from 7.30 Report 30 July 1993)
PAUL LYNEHAM, PRESENTER: Gentlemen, thanks for your royal and Republican presences.
Malcolm Turnbull, seeing as you want to makes the changes let's start with you, and let's start with the basics. Why should we scrap a system that has served our country well for generations?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Australia is a unique and independent country, and all of its institutions and symbols should be unequivocally and unambiguously Australian.
LIZ JACKSON: This was one of the earliest of many confrontations, between Malcolm Turnbull and Tony Abbott.
PAUL LYNEHAM: Tony Abbott?
TONY ABBOTT: I'm proud of Australia Paul. I'm proud of our history, our culture and our institutions and I think they should be preserved, not rubbished.
You see, this debate isn't about the R it's about the Australian constitution. A constitution designed for Australians, by Australians and a constitution that has worked very well. If it aint broke, let's not fix it.
LIZ JACKSON: Over the years that
they were often sparring partners.
TONY ABBOTT: You see, what makes our constitution work...
MALCOLM TURNBULL: It's something that we're stuck with forever? We're stuck with the British Monarchy forever, is that right?
TONY ABBOTT: My turn.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: It got personal and ugly.
(Footage from forum at Sydney Institute 2004)
AUDIENCE MEMBER (to Tony Abbott): I'm interested to know if you still hold to your excellent assessment of Malcolm Turnbull, quote 'arrogant, rude, obnoxious, a filthy rich merchant banker' (laughter) just a minute... just a minute... 'a filthy rich merchant banker out of touch with real Australians' end of quote'.
TONY ABBOTT: Well look, I can't remember myself ever saying anything (laughter) quite as concise as that, um, but look... look, um, you know, Malcolm's probably said worse about me.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, you know, it wasn't... it was, ah... it was nasty and personal and vicious, but a lot of politics, sadly, is like that.
JOHN HOWARD: How much would you credit him with the fact that Australia has retained the constitutional system that we have? I mean, how much would you say he's...
JOHN HOWARD: Oh, I'd give him... he's one of the dozen or so people who played a major role.
TONY ABBOTT (7 March 1994): I played a couple of halves of rugby for Manly on the weekend and wasn't so good for the facial good looks...
LIZ JACKSON: It's March 1994. Tony Abbott is 36 and about to enter Parliament.
LIZ JACKSON: The big guns of the Liberal Party are at his campaign launch for the Blue Ribbon seat of W a wealthy electorate that covers Sydney's Northern beaches. John Hewson was still hanging on as party leader.
Tony Abbott defeated 13 other candidates to win pre-selectio reportedly with an impressive speech and an impressive list of referees. They included radio broadcaster Alan Jones, and Liberal power broker John Howard.
JOHN HOWARD: I think it helped because I had a lot of currency in the party organisation in New South Wales.
That was 1994, and I had a lot of, I guess, that people would take some notice of what I said. And it no doubt helped him.
(Archive footage of celebration of Tony Abbott's pre-selection victory 7 March 1994)
JOHN HEWSON: So congratulations Tony, we're delighted to be here, and we might get you to say a few words.
LIZ JACKSON: Abbott was gracious and a little overwhelmed.
TONY ABBOTT: If I can raise the Liberal torch high, it's only because you, all of you, are holding me up. Just as I said there's nothing wrong with the A there's nothing wrong with the Liberal party's rank and file.
So let's light a torch today - a golden torch - that will burn bright throughout our local area and, who knows, just might be seen right round this big brown land. Thank you very much. (Applause).
(End of footage).
LIZ JACKSON: Hovering around the fringe of this event is Liberal Party member David Oldfield, later to be employed as Tony Abbott's private secretary.
Unbeknownst to Abbott, Oldfield used time in Abbott's office to set up Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party. Four Corners reported this in 1998.
(Archive footage from Four Corner 1998)
TONY JONES, REPORTER: A rising star in the Liberal Party, Tony Abbott's political career took a battering when it became known that Oldfield had laboured secretly to form One Nation while on his staff.
TONY ABBOTT: My inclination was always to assume that the aggressive right wing views were out of character, that was my inclination. You always give members of your own team the benefit of the doubt. In retrospect I was wrong.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: By mid 2001, when Four Corners made a program about the working poor, Tony Abbott was Minister for Employment.
(Archive footage from Four Corners 2001)
STEPHEN MCDONELL, REPORTER: Zenny is on her way to work. As usual, she's heading to the big five star hotel where she's employed as a house keeper.
LIZ JACKSON: The program focussed on the problems faced by working families who were living below the poverty line.
STEPHEN MCDONELL: She's worked five days a week in the same job as a house maid for 13 years.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott's response on the working poor caused outrage in the welfare community.
TONY ABBOTT: It's the responsibility of government to try to put policies in place which over time will allow people to improve their situation. But we can't abolish poverty because poverty in part is a function of individual behaviour.
we can't stop people havin we can't stop people from making mistakes that cause them to be less well-off than they might otherwise be.
(End of footage)
TIM COSTELLO, CEO WORLD VISION: Tony hasn't changed. The essence of Tony is still the views that say 'well, that's personal responsibility and the best thing is markets and wealth creation. Government can do that, the rest any real intervention is foolish'.
LIZ JACKSON: Four weeks ago, in a Canberra meeting with Catholic Social Services Tony Abbott was asked
(On screen text: The government have committed to halving homelessness by 2020. Should your Party be elected, would you continue with that commitment?)
Abbott responded that he had difficulties with it, adding:
(On screen text: We just can't stop people from being homeless if that's their choice)
TIM COSTELLO: Sure, there are many homeless people who choose to be homeless or drink or gamble, but there's many mentally ill who want to be in a bed, and I've sat for hours trying to get people who need a bed at night - a bed - and can't get them one.
There... a target of reducing by half the 100,000 homeless on our streets - 12,000 of whom are kids - I think is a really good target. It was bipartisan with Malcolm Turnbull and for Tony to reject that target, I actually think is sad.
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I'd like to see homelessness reduced to zero if possible, but I think it's very unlikely that in this veil of tears that's ever likely to be achieved.
LIZ JACKSON: But the question is, Malcolm Turnbull undertook a bipartisan approach on the issue of halving homelessness by 2020.
Will you continue that commitment because in the light of your remarks a couple of weeks ago, welfare agencies are concerned about that?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I support governments doing whatever they reasonably can to bring homelessness down, and I am... I have... I see no reason to oppose the actual measures that the government has put in place in this area.
LIZ JACKSON: And you'll continue the bipartisan commitment to halve it by 2020?
TONY ABBOTT: I think it's important to try to bring homelessness down.
LIZ JACKSON: Why are you backing off saying that you're...
TONY ABBOTT: Well, because...because if it doesn't happen...
LIZ JACKSON: Malcolm Turnbull actually gave that commitment.
TONY ABBOTT: But Liz, if it doesn't happen, I don't want people to say well, you know, Abbott gave this commitment and he's failed to achieve it.
LIZ JACKSON: By the end of 2003, Tony Abbott had been promoted into Howard's Cabinet as Minister for Health. Controversy over abortion and religion was coming around the corner.
(Archive footage of Tony Abbott talking to media 2005)
TONY ABBOTT: Well, let me just take my helmet off.
REPORTER: Your article in The Australian the other day provoked q people accused you of using terms like backyard abortions and internet muck and...
TONY ABBOTT: Well, the term I used was a backyard miscarriage and that is a possible risk if...
LIZ JACKSON: In 2005 a debate erupted over whether the Health Minister should keep his right to veto the abortion drug, RU486.
TONY ABBOTT: One of the things that has very much disappointed me is the suggestion that there is a problem with ministerial decision making here because as a Catholic I can't be trusted to make an objective decision. Okay, that's probably enough...
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: Four women Parliamentarians put up a cross party private members bill to remove the Ministerial veto. Former Democrat Lyn Allison was one of them.
LYN ALLISON, AUSTRALIAN DEMOCRATS LEADER : Well, there was no... there were no guidelines as to how that veto would be exercised.
So it would be a political decision, and if you had a Minister who was vehemently opposed to abortion, you could expect that that veto would be... would be one that'd be used.
Ah, and in any case there was no justification for it. We did have an expert group, the TGA - Therapeutic Goods Administration - and it was their job to assess the safety of medicines into this country. There just was no purpose in this veto being applied by the Health Minister.
(Archive footage of Parliament sitting on 15 Feb 2006)
TONY ABBOTT: If people want an abortion there is ample opportunity already to have one.
LIZ JACKSON: For Tony Abbott the debate about the veto produced this response about the morality of abortion.
TONY ABBOTT: Mr Speaker, we have a biz a bizarre double standard in this country where some-one who kills a pregnant woman's baby is guilty of murder, but a woman who aborts an unborn baby is simply exercising choice.
Now Mr Speaker, I want to make it clear that I do not judge or condemn any woman who has had an abortion, but every abortion is a tragedy and up to 100,000 abortions a year is this generation's legacy of unutterable shame.
(End of footage)
LYN ALLISON: Well, that had nothing to do with the veto. The abortions took place whether there was RU486 available or not. Certainly the argument was put that if you make abortion easier, more women will have it, which I found extraordinary.
I mean women have abortions because they don't want to have the baby, not because a method is available, not b. So he continued to show absolutely no understanding of why women make these decisions.
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): You said in your speech in Parliament that you wanted to make clear that you don't judge a woman who's had an abortion.
Yet at the same time you said 100,000 women choose to destroy their unborn babies every year, that a grave decision has been reduced to one of a woman's convenience, and the legacy of this is one of unutterable shame.
Can you see why women might feel that you are judging them for having an abortion, and indeed, judging them harshly?
TONY ABBOTT: I'm not, because Liz, there must be a million, maybe two million Australian women who are in that position, including people who I know extremely well.
Now, the last thing I would want to do is to make a harsh judgement or to be judgemental in any way about people who are wrestling with an incredibly difficult situation.
LIZ JACKSON: But you described the decision they made as one of convenience that led to a legacy of unutterable shame. How could you...
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I think...
LIZ JACKSON: Could women not feel that that is judging them and judging them harshly?
TONY ABBOTT: Liz, I think it is a tragedy that we have as many abortions as we do, but the interesting thing about this Liz is that on the general principle my views and Kevin Rudd's and Kristina Keneally's are almost identical, and yet politicians on the right get hassled about this in a way that politicians on the left don't.
LIZ JACKSON: Maybe it's the language?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, as I said, I think that ah the Prime Minister and the Premier ought to be taxed on this just as I am.
LIZ JACKSON: At the end of the day, after a conscience vote the B the veto was removed.
TONY ABBOTT (to assembled supporters): Western civilisation came to this country in 1788 and I'm proud of that...
LIZ JACKSON: Throughout his political career Tony Abbott has never tried to hide his strong views on mor his vigorous opposition to embryonic stem cell research, to euthanasia, abortion, and his strong support for the traditional family.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT: I don't think he's the sort of character who would be looking to enforce his will on a reluctant nation, but you know, his own views... yeah, of course they shape his politics.
What would he like to see in an ideal world? Catholic morality.
TONY ABBOTT: Of course, we are all influenced by a value system that we hold, but in the end, every decision that a politician makes is, or at least should, in our society be based on the normal sorts of considerations.
It's got to be pu not only justifiable in accordance a private belief.
LIZ JACKSON: At the end of 2007, after eleven and a half years as Prime Minister John Howard lost the election and his seat.
Many of his senior Ministers had urged him in the interests of the Party to stand down, to pass the baton to Peter Costello, but Tony Abbott was loyal to the end.
TONY ABBOTT (Four Corners 2008): From the very beginning of the government to its last day, I thought John Howard was the best man to lead the team.
JOHN HOWARD: Tony was a very strong loyal supporter of mine, but that's not the principal reason - it's an important reason - it's not the principal reason why I am a fan of his.
LIZ JACKSON: He said himself that he didn't contest the leadership after the election was lost in 2007 because colleagues had said two things to him. One - that he was too hard line, and two - that he was too close to you.
JOHN HOWARD: Well, I don't know whether colleagues said that to him or not, but I wouldn't have thought being close t I had won four elections.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott watched and waited while first Brendan Nelson and then Malcolm Turnbull assumed the leadership of the Liberal Party. He busied himself with writing his book Battlelines.
(Archive footage of Tony Abbott visiting a bookshop)
TONY ABBOTT: Do you have a book called Battlelines?
BOOKSHOP OWNER: Battlelines? Well, that would be in our war section.
TONY ABBOTT: No, it wouldn't.
BOOKSHOP OWNER: It wouldn't? Who wrote that?
TONY ABBOTT: Me.
BOOKSHOP OWNER: Did you?!
TONY ABBOTT: Yeah, yeah, I wrote it.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott wrote that it was an ideas book and a rallying cry for Liberals, but not a leadership job application.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON (to Nick Minchin): At what point did you form the view that the party needed to change leadership because of your views and others' views on the climate change issue?
NICK MINCHIN, LIBERAL SENATOR: Well, I didn't form that view. I mean, the leadership issue arose because Tony decided that he would you know mount a challenge.
LIZ JACKSON: The opportunity for Tony Abbott to challenge for the leadership was delivered courtesy of the climate change debate.
This is the township of Beaufort, north west of Melbourne. It was his trip here in September last year that Tony Abbott says in Battlelines, changed his thinking about the Government's emissions trading scheme.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, Tony shifted his ground a number of times. In the middle of 2009 he was strongly of the view that we should simply pass the ETS just wave it through, and he published an article in The Australian newspaper saying that.
LIZ JACKSON: But on his drive to a Liberal Party function in Beaufort , Tony Abbott recounts that the local MP told him there was a bush revolt against what country people saw as just a new tax.
Abbott was the draw c the special guest speaker. He spoke about climate change and the editor of the local paper was there.
CRAIG WILSON, EDITOR, PYRENEES ADVOCATE: He was talking about how the science said that there was this issue called climate change and that it existed, but he came out and said it was crap.
LIZ JACKSON: Absolute crap?
CRAIG WILSON: Absolute crap.
LIZ JACKSON: Is that the words you have recorded in your notes?
CRAIG WILSON: Absolute crap. No doubt about it.
LIZ JACKSON: Abbott's comment made page five of the local paper and climate sceptics in the Party were delighted.
CORY BERNADI, LIBERAL SOUTH AUSTRALIA: Frankly, from a personal perspective, I gave a smile and said, well, you know thank God for that.
NICK MINCHIN: Well, I knew that Tony and I had a rather similar view of the issue, so, you know, didn't come as a complete surprise to me.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott says that while driving back to Melbourne, he spoke with Senator Minchin and this crystallised his views.
He now accepted that voting for ETS would fracture the Coalition, while opposing it would give them the chance to campaign against Labor's giant new tax on everything. Politically, it was the way to go.
NICK MINCHIN: I like to pride myself on keeping my finger on the pulse both of internal opinion and the mood of our own grassroots and of public opinion at large. So I was talking to him on that basis on a number of occasions.
LIZ JACKSON: The politics rather than the science?
NICK MINCHIN: Yeah, Yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: Over the next two months Tony Abbott put this to his leader Malcolm Turnbull, sometimes he say on morning bikes rides in Canberra ,but Malcolm Turnbull was unpersuadable, and the word crap still rankles.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, I was very disappointed ah that he said that. I don't think that any reasonable, prudent person in public life, you know, any policy maker in government or in an alternative government, can reasonably say this is all a lot of crap and we don't have to worry about it. We only have to do so much as to you know resolve whatever political issues that there might be.
LIZ JACKSON (Tony Abbott): Malcolm Turnbull tells us that he was disappointed by your comment that climate change is crap.
TONY ABBOTT: Well, that's not exactly what I said. A, it was, if you like, a bit of spur of the moment hyperbole, but b, I was talking about the arguments on climate change, in particular the argument that the that the science is settled.
Now, I don't believe that the science is settled. Certainly, I think that climate change happens and I think that prudent governments take reasonable precautions against credible threats.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you worry about global warming?
TONY ABBOTT: I worry about all sorts of things.
LIZ JACKSON: But specifically do you worry about global warming for your children?
TONY ABBOTT: I worry that if we badly damage our economy, we won't have the capacity to adapt to a whole range of things including climate change.
LIZ JACKSON: Two months after Beaufort, Tony Abbott has just won the leadership of the Liberal Party. He's heading to his victory press conference with Deputy Julie Bishop.(Archive footage of Tony Abbott leaving Party Room after leadership victory 1 December 2009)
TONY ABBOTT (to cameramen): Good to see the coordination you guys have got.
LIZ JACKSON: Abbott staked his claim to leadership by taking the fight to Malcolm Turnbull over the issue of climate change and the Party chose Tony Abbott by just one vote.
NICK MINCHIN: Well, in this game, you know, 50 per cent plus one is is all you need, and 50 per cent plus one is a win.
TONY ABBOTT (to media): Well, ladies and gentlemen thanks very much for coming. It's great to be here. It's been a tumultuous week for the Liberal Party. Obviously, it's been a big day for me.
I do feel humbled and daunted by what's ahead, but I also feel proud and exhilarated at the prospect of leading this great political party into the next election.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON (to Nick Minchin): Do you think this means that the party under Tony Abbott will shift to the more conservative side of politics?
NICK MINCHIN: Well look, in the Liberal Party obviously the nature and character of the leader is is influential. But, you know, both Malcolm and Tony are mainstream Liberals, and the Party's essentially mainstream Liberal.
So I don't think you'll see and I don't detect big changes as a result of this change of leadership.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: You've asked me whether he's more conservative than
that's a penetrating glimpse of the obvious to say that.
But I'm not going to run a commentary on Tony Abbott, you know, as as to you know what his pol it's up to him.
LIZ JACKSON: And where those differences might actually play out in terms of policy?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well exactly, that's right. We'll leave, you know, eave that... time will tell.
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): Can you give us a vision of the kind of Australia that you would like to see at the end, were you to make it, at the end of your first term as prime minister?
TONY ABBOTT: Well obviously, I'd like to see an Australia which is richer, which is better respected, and which is more cohesive.
I guess, rather than have some vision of mine that I want to
I would like, if you like, to see everyone's vision more achievable.
It's a series of individual and community visions that I would like to see realised, rather than simply impose my own grand schemes on other people.
[End of transcript]
Return to program page...&
Please note: This transcript is produced by an independent transcription service. The ABC does not warrant the accuracy of the transcript.}
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官方公共微信Four Corners - 15/03/2010: Program Transcript
<meta name="Description" content="Read the program transcript from Liz Jackson's report The Authentic Mr Abbott, first broadcast 19 March 2010.">
CAMERAMAN: Okay, this is Mr Abbott by the looks of it. Oh, this is ideal.
LIZ JACKSON, REPORTER: Tony Abbott is arriving at a primary school in a marginal seat in Perth.
TONY ABBOTT, LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (to school principal): Good to see you. Lo it's great to be here.
LIZ JACKSON: The Federal election has yet to called, but the Opposition's new leader is already in full on campaign mode.
He's after Kevin Rudd's job, and happy to tell anyone who'll listen.
TONY ABBOTT (to school children): I'm from Canberra and I'm what's called the Opposition Leader.
And every day I have an argument with someone called the Prime Minister about who should be leading the country and what's best for the country.
(Tony meeting people in shopping centre)
TONY ABBOTT: G'day, how are you? Tony Abbott.
VOX POP: Hi Tony.
TONY ABBOTT: Hello, how are you?
Tony Abbott, John. I'd better have a lamington I think.
Hello, I'm Tony Abbott.
I can't resist a photo opp.
VOX POP 2: You've got to do it.
LIZ JACKSON: After the primary school stop, it's the shopping mall just down the road.
The latest poll in Western Australia puts the Coalition now just in front of Labor and we're given a moment to chat.
(To Tony Abbott) Have you thought yet about winning?
TONY ABBOTT: Ah, I don't want to get ahead of myself. I mean, we have to become competitive and we're getting there, but let's wait until we're competitive for a few months before I start to...
LIZ JACKSON: Having those fantasy about power?
TONY ABBOTT: Yeah, that's right, that's right. That's absolutely right, yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: I think I'll let you off the hook at this point.
TONY ABBOTT: Alright. Okay. Thanks Liz. See you soon.
LIZ JACKSON: And we'll catch up for a full on interview later.
The big question still to be asked is how Tony Abbott as the new leader of his party and potentially the nation, will choose to use his power?
MALCOLM TURNBULL, LIBERAL LEADER : You will see, the Liberal Party will have a more conservative, more right wing, if you like, position on many issues with Tony as leader than it would with me.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT, VICE-RECTOR ST PATRICK'S : His own views? Yeah, of course they shape his politics.
What would he like to see in an ideal world? Catholic morality.
JOHN HOWARD, PRIME MINISTER : Tony's an authentic person and I think a lot of people see Tony as somebody who actually believes in something.
JOHN HEWSON, LIBERAL PARTY LEADER : Authentic to what though? To himself? To opportunity?
TONY ABBOTT: How are you Liz?
LIZ JACKSON: Tonight on Four Corners, we're seeking to uncover the authentic Mr Abbott.
(On screen text: The Authentic Mr Abbott)
It's two months since Tony Abbott took over the leader's office. He was, on the day, the only leadership contender calling on Liberal party to ditch its support for an emissions trading scheme.
(Tony Abbot walks down corridor)
TONY ABBOTT (to cameraman): It's a real skill this walking backwards business, isn't it?
LIZ JACKSON: In the final ballot he defeated Malcolm Turnbull by just one vote.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: I think it was entirely political in Tony's case. The real issue for me is the policy. You know, the... why are we in public life? Why am I a Member of Parliament?
I'm a Member of Parliament to make Australia a safer and a better place for Australians today and for Australians in generations to come. And we cannot do that without having an effective policy on climate change.
LIZ JACKSON: Inside the party room Abbott's early success in the polls is regarded as proof positive that Abbott read the politics right.
It's good too for old friends and John Howard's stalwarts, now back on the front bench.
There's also a mood change here - a buzz - that maybe now the Liberals have a leader who just might win.
TONY ABBOTT: Okay, colleagues this is our second party room meeting of the year. We meet under even better circumstances than we did last week. Yes, we can win.
PARTY ROOM (in unison): Hear, hear.
TONY ABBOTT: And I want to say to all of you, go out there, sell the message, respect your colleagues, but train your fire on the other side and we can win this election.
PARTY ROOM (in unison): Hear, hear.
(Applause from party room)
CHRISTOPHER PYNE, SHADOW MINISTER FOR EDUCATION: Our thinking has moved from holding onto the furniture at the next election, to build after that, ah to we cou It's possible that we could win the election.
JOHN HOWARD: We are in now with a chance, but you can't put it any more strongly than that at present.
LIZ JACKSON: And that's down to Tony Abbott?
JOHN HOWARD: Yes. Tony has altered there's no doubt about that. There's no disrespect to anybody else, but if you don't recognise that, well, you don't recognise anything about Australian politics.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott grew up in a comfortably well off conservative Catholic family on Sydney's north shore.
(On screen: Photo of Tony as a boy).
This is him at his first communion. He was the eldest of four children and long time friends say his family thought he was the star.
FATHER EMMETT COSTELLO, CHAPLIN, ST IGNATIUS' COLLEGE : His mother and father had boundle boundless ambition. And they naturally promoted all his ambitions extensively and he was... I think he had three sisters. Well, Tony was the most intelligent in the family by far.
GREG SHERIDAN, FRIEND: I think they all thought Tony was a bit of a star, but at the same time they had a very good teasing relationship with him.
LIZ JACKSON: In 1970 Tony Abbott was sent to St Ignatius' College, Riverview.
(On screen: photo of school class)
This is his first form class photo. The College was founded by the Jesuits back in 1880 on Sydney's Lane Cove River. It's one of the most prestigious and expensive Catholic Schools in the country.
ANTHONY CURTAIN, SCHOOL FRIEND: You've been to the grounds. I mean, it's a magnificent spot. You know, there are opportunities that you have there that you may not have at other schools.
So, you know, it was... basically it was a privilege to be able to go there.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott came top of his year in form one, form two, form three and form four. In his final year he won His Eminence the Cardinal's prize for Religious Knowledge. Father Emmett Costello says the young Tony Abbott's faith was deep.
FATHER EMMETT COSTELLO: Very deep, unlike other boys at that age. Always very deep, and that's rather... surprised me.
ANTHONY CURTAIN: I think society generally was much more religious, and certainly I think, you know, our parents... it was a prime reason for sending us to the school.
LIZ JACKSON: In 1976 Tony Abbott enrolled to study economics law at Sydney University.
He threw himself into student politics as a warrior for the right. Within a year he was on the Students Representative Council. Within three, he was the SRC president.
The Australian's Greg Sheridan was one of his close friends.
GREG SHERIDAN: That was a very left dominated undergraduate life. You know, most students didn't vote
it was only a small minority of people who bothered to vote, and those who voted were generally on the left.
And it was unusual, indeed it was almost ah unheard of, for someone who was taking a strong anti-left position to win a popular election like that. So they... they really detested him.
LIZ JACKSON (to Margaret Kirby): What in your view was he trying to achieve?
MARGARET KIRBY, SRC WOMEN'S COLLECTIVE : He wanted to smash the left and feminist forces.
LIZ JACKSON: One of Tony Abbott's main targets was the SRC itself. He led an unsuccessful campaign against its compulsory student fees.
TONY ABBOTT (to reporter 1979): I do not think that the SRC has been looking after student interests. Its polici they've been radical and they've been divisive. In fact, I think it can be said that all the SRC has done is give students a bad name in recent years.
LIZ JACKSON: He wrote colourful accounts of the SRC
this about the Women's Collective.
(On screen text: Grim faced, overall clad, hard, strident, often lustfully embracing in a counterfeit of love).
And this was Abbott on feminism.
(On screen text: I think it would be folly to expect that women will ever dominate or even approach equal representation in a large number of areas simply because their aptitudes, abilities and interests are different for physiological reasons).
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): What do you think about those views now?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I just don't want to go over old ground too much Liz.
Ah, I don't want to repudiate what was said, but I don't want people to think that what I thought as a 21 year old is necessarily what I think as a 52 year old.
LIZ JACKSON (to Malcolm Turnbull): Do you remember Tony Abbott from student days?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Ah, not... not terribly well. He was a few years behind me, so I had you know
not a lot.
LIZ JACKSON: But you wrote about him when you were working at The Bulletin?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Yes, that's right. I had something to say about him in an article in The Bulletin. I'd written about student...student politics, yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you remember what you said?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Not really, no. You remind me.
LIZ JACKSON: The Bulletin, 1978. The journalist, Malcolm Turnbull.
(One screen text: The leading light of the right wingers in New South Wales is twenty-year-old Tony Abbott. He has written a number of articles... (which have) given him a stature his rather boisterous and immature rhetoric doesn't really deserve. Abbott is opposed to any legalisation of homosexuality and generally presents an old fashioned DLP image)
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): When did you change your mind on that?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I guess as time has gone by I've had a much wider experience of life, certainly when it comes to homosexuality.
I have many friends who are gay. I've never had a personal issue with it. I've always treated people as I find them and that's the way it should be.
LIZ JACKSON: At the end of 1980 Tony Abbott won a Rhodes scholarship to Oxford University.
He came away with an MA in politics and philosophy, and two Oxford blues for boxing.
The local paper headlined his debut fight 'Action Man Abbo blasts his way to victory', and reported him as saying of one of his later wins 'I just made believe my opponent was Bob Hawke, the leader of the Labor Party'.
Within a year of returning from Oxford, Tony Abbott had decided to train for the priesthood. It was a decision he discussed with Jesuit priest and friend, Father Michael Kelly.
LIZ JACKSON (to Father Michael Kelly): Can you illuminate that decision for us?
FATHER MICHAEL KELLY, FRIEND: Tony's of a generation and I'm of that generation too that really prized, actually, the ideals and the sacrifice entailed in... in priestly service.
I mean there's no money in it, there's no sex in it and there's no rea in fact now you're something of a... perceived as being some of a social neuter or an inadequate person in some way if you're a priest.
But 30 years ago... 30 years ago there was a culture that saw that sort of idealism and self-sacrifice as a noble thing.
LIZ JACKSON: Why do you think he chose to go to St Patricks rather than with the Jesuits?
FATHER MICHAEL KELLY: He wanted to be Archbishop of Sydney.
LIZ JACKSON: St Patrick's College opened in 1889. It was the oldest and largest seminary in the country. The trainee priests and their superiors had heard about Abbott before he arrived.
NOEL DEBIEN, CLASSMATE, ST PATRICK'S COLLEGE: He was known for his boxing, for his success at Oxford. He was a big fish who was coming into what was effectively a small pond.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT: The former rector, the fellow who was in charge of the place before I got there, had remarked to me of Tony that, you know, we needed to look af that if he... outside of this place, he could be Prime Minister you know.
Now, I was never quite as impressed as that, but I mean, a very capable guy.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott spent three years struggling to be a priest, then quit and went public. He wrote in the Bulletin that his dream had died. He missed, he said, 'the glittering company of Oxford, the student hurly-burly'.
The seminary 'lacked imagination and virility' and the 'lack of sensual intimacy had' in his case 'become a heavy burden'. He had reached the point of 'loathing' the place.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT: 'I loathed it'. There can be a flamboyance to... an extravagance to Tony's way of putting things - the one the one liner - and sometimes going to the extreme version for impact, he'll do that.
NOEL DEBIEN: Some people thought a semina that a seminaria that a seminarian should not make waves. That wasn't Tony.
TONY ABBOTT: It was difficult time of my life because I was wrestling with what I thought was a calling, but I was also wrestling with my nature, which didn't take easily to the life of the seminary. And I guess that was why I found it... I found it difficult and ultimately why I left.
It was while Tony Abbott was working as a journalist for the Bulletin, that he first met John Howard. They got on well.
JOHN HOWARD: Very intelligent, easy to talk to, had a lot of
was traditional about a lot of things, but he was also somebody with a great enquiring mind.
LIZ JACKSON: When you say a lot of ideas similar to your own, what sort of things are you talking about?
JOHN HOWARD: Well, he saw Australia as something of an outpost of Western civilisation and values in the Asian Pacific region, and having to combine the history and the geography of our country, which he thought we could do...
LIZ JACKSON: Did you spot him as a potential political talent early on?
JOHN HOWARD: Oh yes, I thought he had real political talent, and he'd been... he'd been active in in university politics. Ah, and I'd heard about his activism in university politics and he was obviously active on the anti-Labor side.
(Archive footage from rugby match)
COMMENTATOR: He's done it again. Four straight penalty goals...
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: In 1990 John Howard ran into Tony Abbott at the Sydney Football stadium. Abbott wanted to move into politics, and John Howard was happy to help.
JOHN HEWSON (3 April 1990): Today is a new start.
LIZ JACKSON: There was job going as press secretary to Dr John Hewson, who'd just become the Liberal leader.
JOHN HOWARD: And I said to Tony, 'you want to go and work for Hewie?' And he did.
JOHN HEWSON: He was one of the most interesting and challenging people on the one hand, and one of the most frustrating people I've ever met in my life, and I think that summarises him.
LIZ JACKSON: And why do you say frustrating?
JOHN HEWSON: Ton always has had his own agenda, and it was often difficult to know what it was.
I mean, sometimes you just thought it was to be outlandish and other times it was to, you know, he was... he had a pretty strong view about a particular issue.
He was always pretty much on the right, and issues that were very important to him, like the monarchy, he would allow to dominate his thinking on other issues as well.
(Archive news footage of Dr Hewson entering Parliament)
REPORTER: Good morning Dr Hewson, the ANZ job figures...
LIZ JACKSON: Despite their differences Dr Hewson acknowledges his former press secretary knows how to use the media.
JOHN HEWSON: What you've got is constant colour and movement, and he's very good at it. His strengths are, he's... he's obviously very bright, but he's very cunning, and I think that cunningness shows.
And he can see and issue and he can grab an issue. And how does he handle it? He gets right in your face. H he grabs the headlines, even if he knows that the next day he's gonna have to back that off.
Good example is the accusation this week... last week of, you know, a bribe to Channel 7 with the... with the reduction in the TV license fees.
The word bribe appears, it gets the headline, it creates all the atmosphere. Next day he doesn't
he just says it doesn't look good, let's go on. And he's played that role out.
JOHN HEWSON (13 March 1993): Finally, I want to thank th they shared our dream.
LIZ JACKSON: After Dr Hewson lost the unlosable election, Hewson and Abbott parted ways. Tony Abbott took a job as the Executive Director of Australians for Constitutional Monarchy.
JOHN HEWSON: Well, I was pleased he did because I encouraged him to do it. I think I had a big role in T I did.
LIZ JACKSON: And what did you say to encourage him to do that?
JOHN HOWARD: Well, I told him a couple of things. I said 'mate, you're a believer in this cause. There aren't too many people who've got the guts at the moment to put their hands up for it' because it was pretty unfashionable with the media.
And at that time the polls seemed to be going heavily against the status quo. And I said 'on top of that Tony, it will bring you into contact with a lot of people who are active Liberals and that won't do your future aspirations any harm'.
(Archive footage from 7.30 Report 30 July 1993)
PAUL LYNEHAM, PRESENTER: Gentlemen, thanks for your royal and Republican presences.
Malcolm Turnbull, seeing as you want to makes the changes let's start with you, and let's start with the basics. Why should we scrap a system that has served our country well for generations?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Australia is a unique and independent country, and all of its institutions and symbols should be unequivocally and unambiguously Australian.
LIZ JACKSON: This was one of the earliest of many confrontations, between Malcolm Turnbull and Tony Abbott.
PAUL LYNEHAM: Tony Abbott?
TONY ABBOTT: I'm proud of Australia Paul. I'm proud of our history, our culture and our institutions and I think they should be preserved, not rubbished.
You see, this debate isn't about the R it's about the Australian constitution. A constitution designed for Australians, by Australians and a constitution that has worked very well. If it aint broke, let's not fix it.
LIZ JACKSON: Over the years that
they were often sparring partners.
TONY ABBOTT: You see, what makes our constitution work...
MALCOLM TURNBULL: It's something that we're stuck with forever? We're stuck with the British Monarchy forever, is that right?
TONY ABBOTT: My turn.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: It got personal and ugly.
(Footage from forum at Sydney Institute 2004)
AUDIENCE MEMBER (to Tony Abbott): I'm interested to know if you still hold to your excellent assessment of Malcolm Turnbull, quote 'arrogant, rude, obnoxious, a filthy rich merchant banker' (laughter) just a minute... just a minute... 'a filthy rich merchant banker out of touch with real Australians' end of quote'.
TONY ABBOTT: Well look, I can't remember myself ever saying anything (laughter) quite as concise as that, um, but look... look, um, you know, Malcolm's probably said worse about me.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, you know, it wasn't... it was, ah... it was nasty and personal and vicious, but a lot of politics, sadly, is like that.
JOHN HOWARD: How much would you credit him with the fact that Australia has retained the constitutional system that we have? I mean, how much would you say he's...
JOHN HOWARD: Oh, I'd give him... he's one of the dozen or so people who played a major role.
TONY ABBOTT (7 March 1994): I played a couple of halves of rugby for Manly on the weekend and wasn't so good for the facial good looks...
LIZ JACKSON: It's March 1994. Tony Abbott is 36 and about to enter Parliament.
LIZ JACKSON: The big guns of the Liberal Party are at his campaign launch for the Blue Ribbon seat of W a wealthy electorate that covers Sydney's Northern beaches. John Hewson was still hanging on as party leader.
Tony Abbott defeated 13 other candidates to win pre-selectio reportedly with an impressive speech and an impressive list of referees. They included radio broadcaster Alan Jones, and Liberal power broker John Howard.
JOHN HOWARD: I think it helped because I had a lot of currency in the party organisation in New South Wales.
That was 1994, and I had a lot of, I guess, that people would take some notice of what I said. And it no doubt helped him.
(Archive footage of celebration of Tony Abbott's pre-selection victory 7 March 1994)
JOHN HEWSON: So congratulations Tony, we're delighted to be here, and we might get you to say a few words.
LIZ JACKSON: Abbott was gracious and a little overwhelmed.
TONY ABBOTT: If I can raise the Liberal torch high, it's only because you, all of you, are holding me up. Just as I said there's nothing wrong with the A there's nothing wrong with the Liberal party's rank and file.
So let's light a torch today - a golden torch - that will burn bright throughout our local area and, who knows, just might be seen right round this big brown land. Thank you very much. (Applause).
(End of footage).
LIZ JACKSON: Hovering around the fringe of this event is Liberal Party member David Oldfield, later to be employed as Tony Abbott's private secretary.
Unbeknownst to Abbott, Oldfield used time in Abbott's office to set up Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party. Four Corners reported this in 1998.
(Archive footage from Four Corner 1998)
TONY JONES, REPORTER: A rising star in the Liberal Party, Tony Abbott's political career took a battering when it became known that Oldfield had laboured secretly to form One Nation while on his staff.
TONY ABBOTT: My inclination was always to assume that the aggressive right wing views were out of character, that was my inclination. You always give members of your own team the benefit of the doubt. In retrospect I was wrong.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: By mid 2001, when Four Corners made a program about the working poor, Tony Abbott was Minister for Employment.
(Archive footage from Four Corners 2001)
STEPHEN MCDONELL, REPORTER: Zenny is on her way to work. As usual, she's heading to the big five star hotel where she's employed as a house keeper.
LIZ JACKSON: The program focussed on the problems faced by working families who were living below the poverty line.
STEPHEN MCDONELL: She's worked five days a week in the same job as a house maid for 13 years.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott's response on the working poor caused outrage in the welfare community.
TONY ABBOTT: It's the responsibility of government to try to put policies in place which over time will allow people to improve their situation. But we can't abolish poverty because poverty in part is a function of individual behaviour.
we can't stop people havin we can't stop people from making mistakes that cause them to be less well-off than they might otherwise be.
(End of footage)
TIM COSTELLO, CEO WORLD VISION: Tony hasn't changed. The essence of Tony is still the views that say 'well, that's personal responsibility and the best thing is markets and wealth creation. Government can do that, the rest any real intervention is foolish'.
LIZ JACKSON: Four weeks ago, in a Canberra meeting with Catholic Social Services Tony Abbott was asked
(On screen text: The government have committed to halving homelessness by 2020. Should your Party be elected, would you continue with that commitment?)
Abbott responded that he had difficulties with it, adding:
(On screen text: We just can't stop people from being homeless if that's their choice)
TIM COSTELLO: Sure, there are many homeless people who choose to be homeless or drink or gamble, but there's many mentally ill who want to be in a bed, and I've sat for hours trying to get people who need a bed at night - a bed - and can't get them one.
There... a target of reducing by half the 100,000 homeless on our streets - 12,000 of whom are kids - I think is a really good target. It was bipartisan with Malcolm Turnbull and for Tony to reject that target, I actually think is sad.
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I'd like to see homelessness reduced to zero if possible, but I think it's very unlikely that in this veil of tears that's ever likely to be achieved.
LIZ JACKSON: But the question is, Malcolm Turnbull undertook a bipartisan approach on the issue of halving homelessness by 2020.
Will you continue that commitment because in the light of your remarks a couple of weeks ago, welfare agencies are concerned about that?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I support governments doing whatever they reasonably can to bring homelessness down, and I am... I have... I see no reason to oppose the actual measures that the government has put in place in this area.
LIZ JACKSON: And you'll continue the bipartisan commitment to halve it by 2020?
TONY ABBOTT: I think it's important to try to bring homelessness down.
LIZ JACKSON: Why are you backing off saying that you're...
TONY ABBOTT: Well, because...because if it doesn't happen...
LIZ JACKSON: Malcolm Turnbull actually gave that commitment.
TONY ABBOTT: But Liz, if it doesn't happen, I don't want people to say well, you know, Abbott gave this commitment and he's failed to achieve it.
LIZ JACKSON: By the end of 2003, Tony Abbott had been promoted into Howard's Cabinet as Minister for Health. Controversy over abortion and religion was coming around the corner.
(Archive footage of Tony Abbott talking to media 2005)
TONY ABBOTT: Well, let me just take my helmet off.
REPORTER: Your article in The Australian the other day provoked q people accused you of using terms like backyard abortions and internet muck and...
TONY ABBOTT: Well, the term I used was a backyard miscarriage and that is a possible risk if...
LIZ JACKSON: In 2005 a debate erupted over whether the Health Minister should keep his right to veto the abortion drug, RU486.
TONY ABBOTT: One of the things that has very much disappointed me is the suggestion that there is a problem with ministerial decision making here because as a Catholic I can't be trusted to make an objective decision. Okay, that's probably enough...
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON: Four women Parliamentarians put up a cross party private members bill to remove the Ministerial veto. Former Democrat Lyn Allison was one of them.
LYN ALLISON, AUSTRALIAN DEMOCRATS LEADER : Well, there was no... there were no guidelines as to how that veto would be exercised.
So it would be a political decision, and if you had a Minister who was vehemently opposed to abortion, you could expect that that veto would be... would be one that'd be used.
Ah, and in any case there was no justification for it. We did have an expert group, the TGA - Therapeutic Goods Administration - and it was their job to assess the safety of medicines into this country. There just was no purpose in this veto being applied by the Health Minister.
(Archive footage of Parliament sitting on 15 Feb 2006)
TONY ABBOTT: If people want an abortion there is ample opportunity already to have one.
LIZ JACKSON: For Tony Abbott the debate about the veto produced this response about the morality of abortion.
TONY ABBOTT: Mr Speaker, we have a biz a bizarre double standard in this country where some-one who kills a pregnant woman's baby is guilty of murder, but a woman who aborts an unborn baby is simply exercising choice.
Now Mr Speaker, I want to make it clear that I do not judge or condemn any woman who has had an abortion, but every abortion is a tragedy and up to 100,000 abortions a year is this generation's legacy of unutterable shame.
(End of footage)
LYN ALLISON: Well, that had nothing to do with the veto. The abortions took place whether there was RU486 available or not. Certainly the argument was put that if you make abortion easier, more women will have it, which I found extraordinary.
I mean women have abortions because they don't want to have the baby, not because a method is available, not b. So he continued to show absolutely no understanding of why women make these decisions.
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): You said in your speech in Parliament that you wanted to make clear that you don't judge a woman who's had an abortion.
Yet at the same time you said 100,000 women choose to destroy their unborn babies every year, that a grave decision has been reduced to one of a woman's convenience, and the legacy of this is one of unutterable shame.
Can you see why women might feel that you are judging them for having an abortion, and indeed, judging them harshly?
TONY ABBOTT: I'm not, because Liz, there must be a million, maybe two million Australian women who are in that position, including people who I know extremely well.
Now, the last thing I would want to do is to make a harsh judgement or to be judgemental in any way about people who are wrestling with an incredibly difficult situation.
LIZ JACKSON: But you described the decision they made as one of convenience that led to a legacy of unutterable shame. How could you...
TONY ABBOTT: Well, I think...
LIZ JACKSON: Could women not feel that that is judging them and judging them harshly?
TONY ABBOTT: Liz, I think it is a tragedy that we have as many abortions as we do, but the interesting thing about this Liz is that on the general principle my views and Kevin Rudd's and Kristina Keneally's are almost identical, and yet politicians on the right get hassled about this in a way that politicians on the left don't.
LIZ JACKSON: Maybe it's the language?
TONY ABBOTT: Well, as I said, I think that ah the Prime Minister and the Premier ought to be taxed on this just as I am.
LIZ JACKSON: At the end of the day, after a conscience vote the B the veto was removed.
TONY ABBOTT (to assembled supporters): Western civilisation came to this country in 1788 and I'm proud of that...
LIZ JACKSON: Throughout his political career Tony Abbott has never tried to hide his strong views on mor his vigorous opposition to embryonic stem cell research, to euthanasia, abortion, and his strong support for the traditional family.
FATHER BILL WRIGHT: I don't think he's the sort of character who would be looking to enforce his will on a reluctant nation, but you know, his own views... yeah, of course they shape his politics.
What would he like to see in an ideal world? Catholic morality.
TONY ABBOTT: Of course, we are all influenced by a value system that we hold, but in the end, every decision that a politician makes is, or at least should, in our society be based on the normal sorts of considerations.
It's got to be pu not only justifiable in accordance a private belief.
LIZ JACKSON: At the end of 2007, after eleven and a half years as Prime Minister John Howard lost the election and his seat.
Many of his senior Ministers had urged him in the interests of the Party to stand down, to pass the baton to Peter Costello, but Tony Abbott was loyal to the end.
TONY ABBOTT (Four Corners 2008): From the very beginning of the government to its last day, I thought John Howard was the best man to lead the team.
JOHN HOWARD: Tony was a very strong loyal supporter of mine, but that's not the principal reason - it's an important reason - it's not the principal reason why I am a fan of his.
LIZ JACKSON: He said himself that he didn't contest the leadership after the election was lost in 2007 because colleagues had said two things to him. One - that he was too hard line, and two - that he was too close to you.
JOHN HOWARD: Well, I don't know whether colleagues said that to him or not, but I wouldn't have thought being close t I had won four elections.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott watched and waited while first Brendan Nelson and then Malcolm Turnbull assumed the leadership of the Liberal Party. He busied himself with writing his book Battlelines.
(Archive footage of Tony Abbott visiting a bookshop)
TONY ABBOTT: Do you have a book called Battlelines?
BOOKSHOP OWNER: Battlelines? Well, that would be in our war section.
TONY ABBOTT: No, it wouldn't.
BOOKSHOP OWNER: It wouldn't? Who wrote that?
TONY ABBOTT: Me.
BOOKSHOP OWNER: Did you?!
TONY ABBOTT: Yeah, yeah, I wrote it.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott wrote that it was an ideas book and a rallying cry for Liberals, but not a leadership job application.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON (to Nick Minchin): At what point did you form the view that the party needed to change leadership because of your views and others' views on the climate change issue?
NICK MINCHIN, LIBERAL SENATOR: Well, I didn't form that view. I mean, the leadership issue arose because Tony decided that he would you know mount a challenge.
LIZ JACKSON: The opportunity for Tony Abbott to challenge for the leadership was delivered courtesy of the climate change debate.
This is the township of Beaufort, north west of Melbourne. It was his trip here in September last year that Tony Abbott says in Battlelines, changed his thinking about the Government's emissions trading scheme.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, Tony shifted his ground a number of times. In the middle of 2009 he was strongly of the view that we should simply pass the ETS just wave it through, and he published an article in The Australian newspaper saying that.
LIZ JACKSON: But on his drive to a Liberal Party function in Beaufort , Tony Abbott recounts that the local MP told him there was a bush revolt against what country people saw as just a new tax.
Abbott was the draw c the special guest speaker. He spoke about climate change and the editor of the local paper was there.
CRAIG WILSON, EDITOR, PYRENEES ADVOCATE: He was talking about how the science said that there was this issue called climate change and that it existed, but he came out and said it was crap.
LIZ JACKSON: Absolute crap?
CRAIG WILSON: Absolute crap.
LIZ JACKSON: Is that the words you have recorded in your notes?
CRAIG WILSON: Absolute crap. No doubt about it.
LIZ JACKSON: Abbott's comment made page five of the local paper and climate sceptics in the Party were delighted.
CORY BERNADI, LIBERAL SOUTH AUSTRALIA: Frankly, from a personal perspective, I gave a smile and said, well, you know thank God for that.
NICK MINCHIN: Well, I knew that Tony and I had a rather similar view of the issue, so, you know, didn't come as a complete surprise to me.
LIZ JACKSON: Tony Abbott says that while driving back to Melbourne, he spoke with Senator Minchin and this crystallised his views.
He now accepted that voting for ETS would fracture the Coalition, while opposing it would give them the chance to campaign against Labor's giant new tax on everything. Politically, it was the way to go.
NICK MINCHIN: I like to pride myself on keeping my finger on the pulse both of internal opinion and the mood of our own grassroots and of public opinion at large. So I was talking to him on that basis on a number of occasions.
LIZ JACKSON: The politics rather than the science?
NICK MINCHIN: Yeah, Yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: Over the next two months Tony Abbott put this to his leader Malcolm Turnbull, sometimes he say on morning bikes rides in Canberra ,but Malcolm Turnbull was unpersuadable, and the word crap still rankles.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, I was very disappointed ah that he said that. I don't think that any reasonable, prudent person in public life, you know, any policy maker in government or in an alternative government, can reasonably say this is all a lot of crap and we don't have to worry about it. We only have to do so much as to you know resolve whatever political issues that there might be.
LIZ JACKSON (Tony Abbott): Malcolm Turnbull tells us that he was disappointed by your comment that climate change is crap.
TONY ABBOTT: Well, that's not exactly what I said. A, it was, if you like, a bit of spur of the moment hyperbole, but b, I was talking about the arguments on climate change, in particular the argument that the that the science is settled.
Now, I don't believe that the science is settled. Certainly, I think that climate change happens and I think that prudent governments take reasonable precautions against credible threats.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you worry about global warming?
TONY ABBOTT: I worry about all sorts of things.
LIZ JACKSON: But specifically do you worry about global warming for your children?
TONY ABBOTT: I worry that if we badly damage our economy, we won't have the capacity to adapt to a whole range of things including climate change.
LIZ JACKSON: Two months after Beaufort, Tony Abbott has just won the leadership of the Liberal Party. He's heading to his victory press conference with Deputy Julie Bishop.(Archive footage of Tony Abbott leaving Party Room after leadership victory 1 December 2009)
TONY ABBOTT (to cameramen): Good to see the coordination you guys have got.
LIZ JACKSON: Abbott staked his claim to leadership by taking the fight to Malcolm Turnbull over the issue of climate change and the Party chose Tony Abbott by just one vote.
NICK MINCHIN: Well, in this game, you know, 50 per cent plus one is is all you need, and 50 per cent plus one is a win.
TONY ABBOTT (to media): Well, ladies and gentlemen thanks very much for coming. It's great to be here. It's been a tumultuous week for the Liberal Party. Obviously, it's been a big day for me.
I do feel humbled and daunted by what's ahead, but I also feel proud and exhilarated at the prospect of leading this great political party into the next election.
(End of footage)
LIZ JACKSON (to Nick Minchin): Do you think this means that the party under Tony Abbott will shift to the more conservative side of politics?
NICK MINCHIN: Well look, in the Liberal Party obviously the nature and character of the leader is is influential. But, you know, both Malcolm and Tony are mainstream Liberals, and the Party's essentially mainstream Liberal.
So I don't think you'll see and I don't detect big changes as a result of this change of leadership.
MALCOLM TURNBULL: You've asked me whether he's more conservative than
that's a penetrating glimpse of the obvious to say that.
But I'm not going to run a commentary on Tony Abbott, you know, as as to you know what his pol it's up to him.
LIZ JACKSON: And where those differences might actually play out in terms of policy?
MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well exactly, that's right. We'll leave, you know, eave that... time will tell.
LIZ JACKSON (to Tony Abbott): Can you give us a vision of the kind of Australia that you would like to see at the end, were you to make it, at the end of your first term as prime minister?
TONY ABBOTT: Well obviously, I'd like to see an Australia which is richer, which is better respected, and which is more cohesive.
I guess, rather than have some vision of mine that I want to
I would like, if you like, to see everyone's vision more achievable.
It's a series of individual and community visions that I would like to see realised, rather than simply impose my own grand schemes on other people.
[End of transcript]
Return to program page...&
Please note: This transcript is produced by an independent transcription service. The ABC does not warrant the accuracy of the transcript.}
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